NPR speaks with Rep. Pramila Jayapal, D-Wash., about President Trump formally asking Congress to cancel funds it has already approved for public media and foreign aid.
STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Lawmakers called to vote on the recission include Democrat Pramila Jayapal of Washington state, who’s on both relevant committees, foreign affairs and public broadcasting. Welcome to the program.
PRAMILA JAYAPAL: Thank you so much, Steve.
INSKEEP: So I want to ask some bottom-line questions here. On foreign aid first, we’ve documented on NPR that pausing the aid already affected a lot of people overseas. Some people died. But part of the case against this aid is it’s not America’s business, not America’s problem what happens overseas. So tell me, in your view, what is our interest in paying for health clinics or AIDS drugs for Africa, for example?
JAYAPAL: Steve, I worked in global health for many years before coming to Congress, and I think that this has always been in America’s interest for us to make sure that we are addressing the spread of global diseases that cross borders, making sure that we’re investing and helping people to be healthy in those countries, and at the same time, using sort of what’s called our soft power to help governments around the world and to build relationships and partnerships. The funding that this rescissions package is cutting is critical to the health and safety of people around the world. There are some researchers that estimate that over 300,000 people have already died just in four months as a result of the USAID cuts through humanitarian assistance to PEPFAR, which is…
INSKEEP: Yeah.
JAYAPAL: …HIV/AIDS prevention. And so this is just bad on all accounts. And I would just say it’s a tiny, tiny fraction. The entire package is a tiny fraction of what we actually spend at the federal budget.
INSKEEP: That is true. I guess public broadcasting is an even tinier fraction. But let me ask a…
JAYAPAL: Correct.
INSKEEP: …Bottom-line question about that. This money fundamentally goes to local stations. It provides a lot of local news, including on the station we’re hearing now. But there are other points of view about this. I talk with a conservative radio host. I think he sees public broadcasting as competition, doesn’t like subsidized competition in his view, in addition to disagreeing with what he sees as bias. What would you say to him?
JAYAPAL: Well, the attack on public broadcasting is a direct attack on free press in this country because this is the way in which we ensure that 99% of Americans have access to emergency alerts, to local programming, to weather reports. That all comes through these public broadcasting stations, and I would just say that out of the grants, which are about 70% of the funding, 245 of the total 544 radio and TV grantees are considered rural. These are stations that have a harder time raising outside dollars, and by the way, it’s $1.60 per American that goes to fund this public good, which is called the Corporation for Public Broadcasting.
INSKEEP: Just got about 30 seconds left. I want to ask one other question. This is part of a debate over spending. There’s this larger House budget bill that essentially doesn’t address federal debt. It actually increases federal borrowing that my kids are supposed to pay back. In fairness, though, when Democrats were in the majority, you also borrowed trillions of dollars. So in about 20 seconds or so, do you believe it is necessary, somehow soon, to limit federal borrowing?
JAYAPAL: Well, I think that Democrats have always invested in things that return multiple times over. And that’s the question – are we investing in things that are going to help local businesses and economies, or are you giving tax breaks to the wealthiest? And that’s what the big bad betrayal bill of the Republicans is doing, is giving a tax cut to the wealthiest people in this country. And that is not going to help our economy, and it is not going to help ensure that we undermine national debt in the long term.
INSKEEP: But the debt needs to come down? About five seconds here.
JAYAPAL: I think, of course, we always want to cut debt as much as possible, but the question is really about what we invest in.
INSKEEP: Pramila Jayapal of Washington state. Thanks so much for your time. I really appreciate it.
JAYAPAL: Thank you so much, Steve.
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